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Post by rangerdave on Oct 20, 2010 14:20:24 GMT -6
How about this?
Chaos Lord of Tzeentch, Halberd, general, Talisman of Presvervation, Crown of Command 22 warriors of tzeentch, full command, blasted standard, halberds
Chaos Lord of Tzeentch, Talisman of Endurance, Iron Curse Icon, Chaos Runesword 22 warriors of tzeentch, rapturous standard, full command, shields
Exalted Hero of Tzeentch, BSB, Golden Eye of Tzeentch, Enchanted Shield, Favour of the Gods 22 chosen of tzeentch, banner of rage, halberds
Chaos Sorcerer, level 2, dispel scroll, spellshield Joins one of above
Warshrine
It'd be fun, potentially deadly, but difficult in scenario driven games.
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Post by zao77s on Oct 20, 2010 19:39:45 GMT -6
Talk about a bunker unit. I think this would just be avoided, diverted, and shot/magicked to death.
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Post by rangerdave on Oct 21, 2010 14:29:31 GMT -6
This actually looks kinda fun.
Chaos Lord of Tz, general, halberd, talisman of pres, crown of command BSB of Tz, Golden Eye, Enchanted Shield, Favour Lvl 2 sorcerer, scroll, spellshield, iron curse
22 Tz warriors with halberds, full command, rap standard 22 Tz warriors with halberds, full command, banner of rage
8 dragon ogres with great weapon (32 wounds, movement seven, 24 attacks at str 7 and WS 4, Stomp) warshrine of Tz Hell Cannon
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Post by aaronchapman on Oct 21, 2010 23:23:42 GMT -6
What about:
Sorcerer - Level 2, Death, Enchanted Shield, Iron Curse Icon, Dispel Scroll
Exalted - Tzeentch, BSB, Shield, Dragon Helm, Favor of the Gods, Talisman of Endurance
50x Marauders - Khorne, Greatweapons, Full Command 50x Marauders - Khorne, Greatweapons, Full Command 50x Marauders - Khorne, Greatweapons, Full Command
8x Dragon Ogres - Greatweapons 8x Dragon Ogres - Greatweapons
Battle plan...
Characters are cheap, they stay with center unit of Marauders, other 2 marauders flank them. All in 10x5 horde formation to max out at a possible 41 attacks per unit at strength 5!
Dragon Ogres mutually support eachother on one flank, dishing out extreme amounts of punishment in a 4x2 formation with 24 attacks per unit at strength 7!
Magic is not impressive, only goal is to cast 2 character sniping spells each turn if able and maybe stop a few enemy spells too.
Battle Standard is a solid fighter, he'll be able to win some challenges and gain Eye of the gods rolls if lucky enough to fight a character.
It's very direct with really no tactics involved beyond carrying bucket-loads of dice to roll. You shoudl be able to place preassure early on in the game with Dragon Ogres movign into flanks and then 3 units of Horde Marauders will typically make short work of the enemy's front line troops. The 50-men per unit is the only way to make sure they do their job whiel recieving casualties; each unit has 20 wounds to spare before they begin to lose effectiveness.
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Post by rangerdave on Oct 22, 2010 7:27:19 GMT -6
The idea of painting that many marauders makes me weep a little.
I haven't used Marauders a lot, but my experience so far is that they die much too fast.
I do suddenly like the idea of a monster dragon ogre unit smashing through things, but I'd have to convert something as the models out there are so meh.
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Post by zao77s on Oct 22, 2010 8:36:28 GMT -6
Or you could pay a friend to convert them.....
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Post by sdhakala on Oct 22, 2010 8:42:22 GMT -6
Marauders are so squishy, but 50 per unit is hard to kill.
It depends a lot on what you'll be facing. If facing a lot of horde units and not a lot of units or models with T5 or T6, then my preference is chaos ogres over dragon ogres due to the lower cost per model and ability to choose a mark but dragon ogres are quite formidable. 8 DOs with GWs and a champ cost 636 points while 8 choas ogres with GWs, musician, champ, standard and mark of khorne are cost 480 points. Ogres will get more attacks due to MoK, same AS with chaos armour, and have same T4 as DOs but have 1 less W per model, 1 less LD, 1 less M, 1 less S, and 1 less WS. MoK means no panic, fear or terror checks but does require that the BSB be within range to control the charge. Also, you can run 7 chaos ogres with throgg (also monstrous infantry) with champ, standard, and musician and have an even greater number of attacks and the benefits of throgg (to run trolls nearby) for less points than 8 Dos.
In 7th edition, dragon ogres were clearly the better choice but 8th edition gives the ability to step up and have supporting attacks. Thus, the lower cost of chaos ogres makes a unit of 8 chaos ogres with MoK and chaos armour as good or better and much cheaper than the dragon ogres on a points value basis. DOs pay more for GWs and cannot have musicians and standards, whereas chaos ogres pay less for GWs. You could even run that unit with Throgg (monstrous infantry, whereas the DOs don't run with Throgg properly) with a unit of trolls nearby at Alamo. It is funny, but chaos ogres seem better than ogres from a points value perspective due to MoK.
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Post by rangerdave on Oct 22, 2010 9:47:33 GMT -6
Yeah, I think you're right. Khorne Ogres are the better choice. Being able to take a command group is great. I think these are worth playing with and using in place of my knights.
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Post by rangerdave on Oct 22, 2010 10:08:17 GMT -6
Chaos Lord of Tz, Crown of Command, Talisman of Pres, Dragonhelm, halberd Exalted BSB Hero of Tz, Collar of Khorne, Enchanted Shield, Favour of the Gods Chaos Sorcerer, lvl 2, dispel scroll, shield of ptolos (mr 1) Chaos Sorcerer, lvl 2, infernal puppet, ironcurse icon
18 warriors of Tz, full command, halberds, blasted standard (lord and BSB's unit) 18 Warriors of Tz, full command,halberds, rapturous standard (spellcaster's unit) 10 horsemen of khorne, mus, light armor, flails 8 ogres of khorne, mus, banner, great weapons hellcannon warshrine
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Post by zao77s on Oct 22, 2010 11:38:53 GMT -6
Now that is looking nasty. Ugh....I hate WoC.
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Post by sdhakala on Oct 22, 2010 11:40:06 GMT -6
I have a lot of unpainted and some unassembled ogres to borrow, including an extra box of chaos ogre command models, because I wanted to play for fun an army of throgg, trolls, chaos ogres and maybe dragon ogres and dragon ogre shaggoth just to see how it did. BTW, I've typically played a unit of ogres with a smaller unit of knights or with a smaller unit of chosen because they have different strengths and weaknesses. I like the blasted standard but you might consider another standard for the second warriors unit. Also, I've not been a fan of a large horseman block (khorne will force them to charge when you might want them to bait and flee and do other stuff) and losing one model loses the second rank. I'd prefer two units of five with MoS for warmachine hunting.
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Post by rangerdave on Oct 22, 2010 11:48:45 GMT -6
The thinking is that the general makes one unit stubborn, and the other rerolls rapturous standard off the BSB.
I think the conversion and painting opportunities are very cool for Ogres. For dragon ogres, the GW models are really outdated, and I haven't seen any conversions that really impress me using the dragon ogre trunks. I'd rather paint some ogres, do so cool tattoos, slap some chaos bling on them, and let them shred some stuff.
Yeah, I like slaanesh marauders for the control you get over them. I'm not looking for rank, just hitting power. But yes, they vanguard, get beyond the BSB and get out of control really fast.
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Post by aaronchapman on Oct 22, 2010 12:27:01 GMT -6
Dragon ogres are monstrous beasts... so get swiftstride. That makes them both fast on the march, but also very capable of completing charges early. I would suggest that extra wounds and better ld and strength will make them slightly more reliable than ogres of the same points.
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Post by sdhakala on Oct 22, 2010 16:23:56 GMT -6
Yes, all true as I noted. However, DOs don't get a Mark of khorne and thus get fewer attacks for a lot more points and can't include Throgg in the unit for a special character. Also, DOs are so expensive in terms of points costs with GWs that one cannot reliably run two ranks of them and don't have the ability to run full command, so there are benefits.
As for aethetics, the DO models don't fit together properly and the weapons don't fit right either half the time.
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Post by rangerdave on Oct 22, 2010 17:30:17 GMT -6
I just ordered two boxes of Ironguts. The points per model, command group, ability to mark were selling points for me.
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